Article published on the website BURSA On Line, 23.05.2016
TOINE KETS, HORSE CONNECTION: "One of the things I like in Romania is that people are open-minded" BURSA 23.05.2016
* The investment for a 2-day leadership training program with horses is approx. 5000 euro for a group of 10 persons
Toine Kets is a Dutch dedicated full time to human resource area and established in our country since 2005. Together with Helga Meurs, horse trainer, also Dutch, they brought to our country a less-known concept: training/ coaching programs with horses for leaders.
The two Dutch people made a team, Toine being specialist in the contact with people, and Helga in the connection with horses, and they are helping business managers to find out "what leaders they are", which are their strong points and what changes they should do in order to improve their organizations. All these things they can discover through direct contact with horses, extremely intelligent animals - in the opinion of the two Dutch people - who are able to offer all these answers through some simple exercises.
Toine Kets and Helga Meurs told us, within an interview, how these training programs work and how we can find out if we are leaders or not.
Reporter: How would you describe the leadership nowadays?
Toine Kets: For the large part, is a mix. Most people are still managing. I see a lot of leadership training programs, but actually, when we take a better look to them, are actually management ones. Many people want to become leaders, but they don’t know how to do it. In my opinion, the most important step in leadership is to be able to listen, to empathize and to do something.
We are still in transition, thus I am very ambitious with regard to my projects.
Reporter: When did you start the activity here, in Romania?
Toine Kets: We launched the company Actinote, respectively the project Horse Connection in 2007. One of the things I like the most here in Romania is that people are open to these kind of activities. They don’t have questions like "why we should do that", they start doing it.
When we started to organize leadership training programs with horses and the first clients came, they were all very enthusiastic, we received excellent feedback and through the years we transferred everything more here in Romania. Here people are willing to learn, to try to change. We are trying to develop our activity here in Romania, but I am an international trainer, so I am traveling also to Poland, Russia, Ukraine, Germany, Balkans. From Germany to Moscow, we are working with customers asking for coaching, but the activities with horses we are trying to organize it here, in Romania.
Helga Meurs: When we speak about working with horses, we can do this thing anywhere, because the language of the horse is universal. They are speaking through the body language, they are looking at you and are seeing what you cannot see and things that we are not aware of.
Reporter: Why leadership training programs with horses?
Toine Kets: A horse is a free animal. Their eyes are on the sides, which means that they can see everything, are made for running, they cannot fight, can only bite or hit, but they are not fighting. They can see all around, they are trusting the herd leader, otherwise they cannot survive. The leader of the herd is extremely important; everyone is relying on him for surviving.
We are predators, we have the eyes in front, we have nails as the natural predators have and we can focus, what the horses cannot do. Different qualities between us and horses, the fact that we are predators and they are running animals, offer a new dimension. The horse has the capacity to recognize a good leader, thus, when people are in contact with him as leaders, the horse reacts, he can tell you if you are a leader, yes or no, because is in his nature as animal.
The problem doesn’t exist: the horse doesn’t do what I want, but he feels if you are decided or not in what you are doing. It is not about the horse; it is about yourself. As a leader you have to take care that you understand this yourself and to work on it.
The horse can be distracted, and this thing happens also within companies, people are always distracted, you have to learn how to handle these issues.
Reporter: When did you discover these abilities of the horses?
Helga Meurs: For me was long time ago. All my life I was involved in activities with horses, I even studied about them, then I have learned the most. When I am looking to a herd, for me, is like a company, they are like a team and they have a leader, you can learn a lot from them.
Thirty years ago I started my professional field work. After I have met Toine, we started to work for this kind of workshops with horses.
When we have a client, we make a program, there are a lot of exercises, we do what is requested, what we think is needed, depends on the goal of the company’s management team, as well as what they want. Also, for me it’s important the fact that these animals are what they are, more or less, and if you ask them a question, they give you an answer, but you don’t know if is what you are looking for. Therefore, in leadership, empathy, limits, team playing, looking at each other, asking what are the possibilities, these are very important aspects. I think we are raised with the mentality that a thing has to follow a certain path, but maybe you can switch to another one, whichever suits better.
Reporter: Horses need a special training?
Helga Meurs: No, but because I know something about horses, I will choose one that loves to do this kind of work. Each horse can do these exercises, but all has to be safe and secure, and for me it is more important that the horse can manage this. The horses have their own personalities, even if we worked before with them I have to look to them before the exercises, to see how they are doing, how they are feeling. Most of the time they know what comes next, and I actually feel if they will fit in for the exercise or not.
Reporter: How open are the Romanian companies to this kind of trainings? Are they reluctant or they are agreeing from the beginning?
Toine Kets: They don’t say yes from the beginning, but from the moment when they decide to change something, they are very open and willing to do different things. When you tell them that is going to be fun, intense and unique experience, they agree to do it. What I see in Romania is that you receive trust, and when the team we are working with see the changes, it is amazed. The people are changing a lot within a short period of time, they are very flexible. Once that they see how many changes they can do, nothing can stop them.
Reporter: How is carrying out a coaching session with horses?
Toine Kets: After people come to us, we start talking, I try to understand what they want. Based on this first discussion, I contact Helga and then I establish what kind of sessions and exercises will match for achieving the company’s objectives.
We organize everything, we are writing down what are the needed steps and who is doing what. This thing doesn’t mean that we will keep this order, if is needed to change something, we will do it, but we start from the fact that everybody know what to do from the beginning.
After that we prepare different exercises, we are interested to see who is leading during the exercise, how the team is communicating, if they show respect to each other, how everyone reacts. We have to get out people from their comfort zone and to see how they are reacting.
The nonverbal language is more important than the verbal one.
We all know immediately if we like or not something or somebody, but we don’t realize because we are influenced.
Helga Meurs: In these exercises doesn’t exists good or wrong. What is happening in this process we don’t judge, we try only to help, to know and to see what each of us can do.
In general, in the morning we start with individual exercises, and then we have team exercises, on the field, where the company members are seeing each other. I am involved in this process most of the time with horses and Toine with the team and we observe everything from different perspectives, I think it is very important that we are doing this think together.
Toine Kets: Also, we are always asking the participants to evaluate each other. They are always honest and with a positive attitude, because in general we are looking at what people are not doing, but I prefer to look at the talents that people have, at the things they can do and they want to do.
I believe that people should focus on their strong points and to improve them. I don’t think they should work on their weak points, there is no sense, they should valorize their strong points.
When you look at the companies’ managers, you see that often they don’t encourage the employees, they have contact with them only when something is wrong. So the message, when the boss is coming, is that something wrong is happening, so it is not good. As a manager you have to understand the fact that you are not paid for your ugly e-mails or for shouting at your team, you have to encourage people, to motivate them, to work with them in the right direction.
When something doesn’t work as it should, a lot of companies start to work more and more, instead of working more intelligently. Here is a trap. When you work 12 hours per day, your creativity disappears, as well as motivation and passion, because you cannot concentrate at maximum capacity so many hours. And then we take a look at company’s figures which are decreasing and we say that we have to work harder. But no, maybe it is better to step back and to ask ourselves how can we act more intelligently.
For me, the strategy of the companies has to be simple, I have four important questions for them: why do you exist, which are your values, which are your qualities and where are you going. This is, actually, the vision.
I think that we shouldn’t do our work too difficult, you should have fun working, develop the leadership and the company will easily survive.
Reporter: How much does a session cost?
Toine Kets: You have to ask me what is the investment. We often see the education and training as costs and I think it is wrong. Within a company, people are the most important resources and in them you have to invest the most.
For us, the investment for a 2-day session is around 5000 de euro for a group of 10 persons. The individual price is a normal one referring to the international practice, compared with the traditional training by sitting in a classroom. The horses are included in this price.
I cannot give you a precise fare, because we work with different clients, depends on the preparations we have to do, this is a medium price for 2 days, sometimes the clients choose three days or one single day. But what you learn during this training has continuity within the company, it is something strong, doesn’t stop here. That is why we are talking about investment and not about cost.
Helga Meurs: Indeed, you will never forget this experience and for every person will be different.
There are no comments